• Preserving Digital History

    From Boraxman@VERT/MINDS3 to Kaelon on Wed Jul 20 09:33:54 2022
    Re: Preserving Digital History
    By: Kaelon to Boraxman on Tue Jul 19 2022 05:42 am

    During the Renaissance, this problem was tackled programmatically through a variety of specialized roles:

    * ARCHIVISTS were responsible for determining how content would be stored for the long-haul, and built upon the ancient library science and started creating standards for preservation, categorization, and reference.

    * CHRONICLERS reviewed all of the news of the ages and built abridged histories, or Chronicles, of the time, including extentive reference to content that had been archived for future generations to conduct follow-up research.

    * HISTORIANS became the scholars that reviewed the chronicles and cross-referenced with what archivists, and lesser librarians, had stored, in order to produce more 'modern' retrospectives and studies on what really happened and what the impact of what happened was.

    We need similar roles for the new digital age. And I am not really convinced that the Internet Archive has a true archival, chronicling, and historiographic practice for their resspective domains.
    _____
    Agree, but who? Private interests may do it, but likely to monetise it, or not be interested because there isn't a quick return. Churhes? Monasteries?

    I think the solution is custody. Who owns the information, how is it transferred. A way to transfer the public contents of a server before you decommission it. A way for people who are done maintaining their sites to simply hand it over to archivists. This would be more a cultural shift than a technological one.

    We will resolve this issue, but not without a significant period inbetween where a lot of digital information was just thrown to the wind.

    There are already questions about how to handle social media accounts after people die, who takes ownership and such, and I think this problem neatly extends to the one we are discussing.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ MiND'S EYE BBS - Melb, Australia - mindseye.synchronetbbs.org
  • From Kaelon@VERT to Dumas Walker on Tue Jul 19 16:49:25 2022
    Re: "Highly profitable" Bay S
    By: Dumas Walker to KAELON on Tue Jul 19 2022 04:13 pm

    ahhhh, I will check into that!

    As others have mentioned here, I should retract my advice and instead recommend MakeMKV, which has the ability to rip the audio and video streams and completely disregard whatever encryption keys are in store. I had completely spaced on this, probably because it is primarily a command-line Linux application, but I believe there are GUI and Windows/macOS branches of MakeMKV that should work just fine these days.
    _____
    -=: Kaelon :=-

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Vertrauen þ Home of Synchronet þ [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net
  • From Kaelon@VERT to Boraxman on Tue Jul 19 16:53:36 2022
    Re: Preserving Digital History
    By: Boraxman to Kaelon on Wed Jul 20 2022 09:33 am

    I think the solution is custody. Who owns the information, how is it transferred. A way to transfer the public contents of a server before you decommission it. A way for people who are done maintaining their sites to simply hand it over to archivists. This would be more a cultural shift than a technological one.

    This is a great idea! Chain of custody arrangements would certainly be in line with many of our legal and institutional practices. Could we formalize this so that the cultural shift is embedded in technological practices? And how would we contend with the evergreen economic interests that no doubt would prevail? A fascinating proposition, indeed!

    There are already questions about how to handle social media accounts after people die, who takes ownership and such, and I think this problem neatly extends to the one we are discussing.

    Another great observation! I think you are absolutely right; there are very compatible applications between the memorialization of the deceaseds' social media accounts and the need to preserve human knowledge beyond the digital conundrum in which we have found ourselves.
    _____
    -=: Kaelon :=-

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Vertrauen þ Home of Synchronet þ [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Kaelon on Tue Jul 19 17:02:16 2022
    Re: "Highly profitable" Bay S
    By: Kaelon to Dumas Walker on Tue Jul 19 2022 04:49 pm

    As others have mentioned here, I should retract my advice and instead recommend MakeMKV, which has the ability to rip the audio and video streams and completely disregard whatever encryption keys are in store. I had completely spaced on this, probably because it is primarily a command-line Linux application, but I believe there are GUI and Windows/macOS branches of MakeMKV that should work just fine these days.

    There is a GUI version of MakeMKV for Linux.. I didn't even know there was a command-line version..?

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Dumas Walker on Tue Jul 19 19:53:29 2022
    Re: "Highly profitable" Bay S
    By: Dumas Walker to MRO on Tue Jul 19 2022 04:14 pm

    val
    s to xfer chemicals in liquid and powder form.

    i've done that.

    Depending on the chemicals in question, the idea of her operating one of those might also ought to scare anyone. :)

    yeah a guy told me someone got coated in a chemical that burns off your stink but seriously desensatizes it while doing so. so basically you are being eaten alive and don't know it.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From Boraxman@VERT/MINDS3 to Kaelon on Wed Jul 20 16:14:57 2022
    Re: Preserving Digital History
    By: Kaelon to Boraxman on Tue Jul 19 2022 04:53 pm

    This is a great idea! Chain of custody arrangements would certainly be in line with many of our legal and institutional practices. Could we formalize this so that the cultural shift is embedded in technological practices? And how would we contend with the evergreen economic interests that no doubt would prevail? A fascinating proposition, indeed!

    Another great observation! I think you are absolutely right; there are very compatible applications between the memorialization of the deceaseds' social media accounts and the need to preserve human knowledge beyond the digital conundrum in which we have found ourselves.
    _____

    It could be done with some containerisation. A basic static web page is already 'containerised' in that you simply need to transfer the filesystem heirarchy. More complex ones could have export and import automated. I have migrated web pages from server to server and it is something which could be futher automated.

    I could imagine a cPanel option where you can nominate where the site is archived to. Facebook and Google allow you to export your data already. We're mostly there, it is the standardisation of process and interface and creation of formal agreements. Or the nominated archive could simply be pushed an access token that allows it access, similar to how you may have someone as a github collaborator. Cloud based accounts could work similar.

    Peoples 'offline' data is a harder challenge.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ MiND'S EYE BBS - Melb, Australia - mindseye.synchronetbbs.org
  • From Moondog@VERT/CAVEBBS to Dumas Walker on Wed Jul 20 01:35:00 2022
    Re: "Highly profitable" Bay S
    By: Dumas Walker to MRO on Tue Jul 19 2022 04:14 pm

    The fact that she was in a position to possibly be a reactor operator ( assuming nuclear) should be enough to scare anyone.


    they also have chemical reactor operators where you operatore pumps hoses, s to xfer chemicals in liquid and powder form.

    i've done that.

    Depending on the chemicals in question, the idea of her operating one of those might also ought to scare anyone. :)


    * SLMR 2.1a * "Mmmmmmmm.....chocolate."

    I mentioned in another thread that her getting licensed was a job advancment pre-requisite. She'd never touch a piece of real equipment

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From Dumas Walker@VERT/CAPCITY2 to MOONDOG on Wed Jul 20 15:50:00 2022
    I mentioned in another thread that her getting licensed was a job advancment pre-requisite. She'd never touch a piece of real equipment

    Understood, but if she'd not been caught cheating she might have got
    licensed. :O


    * SLMR 2.1a * DALETECH - for all your home security needs!

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From Arelor@VERT/PALANT to Ogg on Thu Jul 21 05:43:45 2022
    Re: "Highly profitable" Bay S
    By: Ogg to Arelor on Sun Jul 17 2022 07:55 am

    Hello Arelor!

    ** On Saturday 16.07.22 - 12:21, Arelor wrote to Moondog:

    Moviemakers know they make much more money from the first
    days after a theatrical release than they do from long term
    royalties and DVD sales.

    Can that really be true? I would think that the physical/
    streaming branch of a release would bring in a more guaranteed
    inflow of cash. Some actors have opted to lower salaries in
    their films for life-time royalties and are richer for that.

    --- OpenXP 5.0.51
    * Origin: Ogg's Dovenet Point (723:320/1.9)
    þ Synchronet þ CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP

    Unless a film has a lot of staying power, it won't make a significant dime past its
    expiration date.

    It is just like books. Books make most of their profit during their commertial lives
    within the first 6 months of publication of so. Then they make the rest by limping
    along through the years with no glory left on their shoulders.

    Now, a film that is a marketing freak of nature will make lots of indirect revenue,
    via licenses and merchandising, but I don't think people counts those :-)


    --
    gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL
  • From Arelor@VERT/PALANT to Boraxman on Thu Jul 21 05:51:36 2022
    Re: "Highly profitable" Bay S
    By: Boraxman to Moondog on Mon Jul 18 2022 07:42 pm

    Re: "Highly profitable" Bay S
    By: Moondog to Boraxman on Sun Jul 17 2022 10:19 pm

    One of the things I liked about buying DVD's was when they offered additional commentary and extra clips and mini-documentaries, such as the making of a movie. Not sure if there is a way to encrypt the director's and
    actor's commentaries into existing video formats.
    I'm pretty sure you can with some container formats, have more than one audio strea

    DVD has multiple audio channels, so you should be able to find a tool which wil let

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ MiND'S EYE BBS - Melb, Australia - mindseye.synchronetbbs.org

    With .mkv you can have as many audio streams and subtitles streams inside a single
    file as you will ever need. YOu can even have multiple video streams inside the same
    file if you ever need that feature.

    --
    gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Arelor on Thu Jul 21 07:30:00 2022
    Arelor wrote to Ogg <=-

    Unless a film has a lot of staying power, it won't make a significant
    dime past its expiration date.

    On the podcast "How did this get made", a podcast about odd movies and
    flops, the host interviewed Mel Brooks about "Solar Babies".

    Yes, that YA post-apocalyptic cheezy flick from the '80s.

    He and Anne Bancroft started Brooks Films, because Mel wanted to get
    involved in dramas, and he was so typecast as a funny guy. They did some interesting films, like Mask, The Elephant Man and The Fly.

    He liked the idea of Solarbabies and liked the pitch - they could film in spain, buy all of the vehicles and support gear there, then sell it for a profit. They wanted $5 million. He thought he could finance that with a
    couple of friends.

    The film is set in a drought-ridden world. It immediately began raining torrents, meaning delays.

    He then had to go back to his friends for another $5 million, and was
    starting to get worried. Everything that usually goes wrong did go wrong.

    More delays, more issues, and he had to go get a second mortgage to get another $5 million.

    The movie came out and the reception was lukewarm. But, VHS came around and
    it got another life in video rentals.

    Mel Brooks said it had finally broke even - in 2014!

    The podcast had me in stiches. Mel Brooks' assistant had told the host that
    he could have 15 minutes with him, but sometimes he goes over. They spoke
    for an hour and a half.




    ... Not building a wall but making a brick
    --- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
    þ Synchronet þ .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.
  • From Ogg@VERT/CAPCITY2 to Arelor on Thu Jul 21 19:32:00 2022
    Hello Arelor!

    ** On Thursday 21.07.22 - 05:43, Arelor wrote to Ogg:

    Unless a film has a lot of staying power, it won't make a
    significant dime past its expiration date.

    It is just like books. Books make most of their profit
    during their commertial lives within the first 6 months of
    publication of so. Then they make the rest by limping along
    through the years with no glory left on their shoulders.

    I see books that were released years ago only NOW getting
    attention. The various young-adult fantasy series by Leigh
    Bardugo:

    Shadow and Bone trilogy (2012)
    Six of Crows duology (2015)

    ..are just a couple are only NOW getting quite popular.


    Court of Thorns and Roses series of 5 fanstasy novels (2015) by
    Sarah Maas, are still quite popular sellers.

    There are numerous other examples of books that exceed the 1st
    6 months that you suggest. ;)


    --- OpenXP 5.0.51
    * Origin: Ogg's Dovenet Point (723:320/1.9)
    þ Synchronet þ CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From Ogg@VERT/CAPCITY2 to Nightfox on Fri Jul 22 07:48:00 2022
    Hello Nightfox!

    ** On Tuesday 19.07.22 - 10:02, Nightfox wrote to Ogg:

    Why sketchy? Did you get a home-burned CD-R version? It
    would be very easy to tell the difference between a
    commercial CD and a CD-R.

    It was a commercially produced copy. I guess it seemed
    sketchy because they seemed to have other copies of the CD
    by itself (without the case) that they could give to
    customers to replace the one they had bought.. For a pawn
    shop, I wouldn't have expected that at the time, I guess.

    Sounds like it was a good coincidence to work in your favour.

    I've received the occassional multiple copy of a CD from a
    single source collection at my shop. But my results are
    haphazard. In the past, I've even managed to buy another copy
    of the same CD a few times for my own collection too! :/


    --- OpenXP 5.0.51
    * Origin: Ogg's Dovenet Point (723:320/1.9)
    þ Synchronet þ CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP