• Re: kermit protocol in sy

    From paulie420@VERT/BEERS20 to Christian Sacks on Wed Aug 16 11:14:00 2023
    Just wanted to post it here as don't know where else would be better, I managed to get the kermit protocol running in Mystic (I know this isn't
    a mystic channel) and really would love it if syncterm could handle the kermit protocol.

    After using it for a little while with qodem, I realise that the transfer speeds in kermit are a lot, and I mean a LOT faster than zmodem for example, and think we could all benefit from having that as an option on BBSes that support kermit.

    Being curious, as I am, I dialed into QW w/ qodem to see what the kermit fuss was all about - QW is across the pond from me, and I usually get fairly bad Zmodem download speeds.

    I was able to get 600+ over kermit - about 4x the speeds I could get over other protocols... at any rate, I'd invite seeing kermit support, too. :P



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  • From paulie420@VERT/BEERS20 to Digital Man on Wed Aug 16 11:15:00 2023
    The ZMODEM protocol also has a lot of options that can impact
    through-put (e.g. windowing or not, window size, encoding/escaping of characters).

    Interesting - sometimes us newbies (me, not ml!) don't think about other variables... I'm gonna do some testing; understood about syncterm requests, thanks.



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  • From fusion@VERT/CFBBS to paulie420 on Wed Aug 16 16:33:00 2023
    On 16 Aug 2023, paulie420 said the following...

    I was able to get 600+ over kermit - about 4x the speeds I could get
    over other protocols... at any rate, I'd invite seeing kermit support, too. :P

    is QW a mystic board? (specifically, using the internal zmodem) .. netrunner uses the same implementation and doesn't fare well according to the sexyz wiki page. maybe it just sucks.

    reminds me of an article i read about DOS file sharing implementations from M$, IBM, etc.. after considerable effort tweaking,the results were kind of like "well, this would have been fast back then" .. even though the hardware is capable of 100x better.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/12/25 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: cold fusion - cfbbs.net - grand rapids, mi
  • From paulie420@VERT/BEERS20 to fusion on Wed Aug 16 13:38:00 2023
    I was able to get 600+ over kermit - about 4x the speeds I could get over other protocols... at any rate, I'd invite seeing kermit support too. :P

    is QW a mystic board? (specifically, using the internal zmodem) .. netrunner uses the same implementation and doesn't fare well according
    to the sexyz wiki page. maybe it just sucks.

    reminds me of an article i read about DOS file sharing implementations from M$, IBM, etc.. after considerable effort tweaking,the results were kind of like "well, this would have been fast back then" .. even though the hardware is capable of 100x better.

    Quantum Wormhole IS a Mystic board... but I get [around] the same Zmodem DL speeds across all BBS softwares. I normally use SyncTerm - but kermit on qodem does seem to beat all of them!



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  • From candycane@VERT/CONCHAOS to paulie420 on Thu Aug 17 01:10:40 2023
    Re: Re: kermit protocol in sy
    By: paulie420 to Christian Sacks on Wed Aug 16 2023 11:14 am

    I was able to get 600+ over kermit - about 4x the speeds I could get over other protocols... at any rate, I'd invite seeing kermit support, too. :P

    Wow, thats so fast!

    candycane

    ===
    user is generated from /dev/urandom

    ...Real knowledge is to know the extent of ones ignorance.
    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ -=[ ConstructiveChaos BBS | conchaos.synchro.net ]=-
  • From paulie420@VERT/BEERS20 to candycane on Thu Aug 17 19:47:00 2023
    I was able to get 600+ over kermit - about 4x the speeds I could get other protocols... at any rate, I'd invite seeing kermit support, too

    Wow, thats so fast!

    I mean - for thru a telnet terminal and all.. :P



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  • From paulie420@VERT/BEERS20 to Christian Sacks on Thu Aug 17 20:09:00 2023
    Kermit is about 6 times faster than Zmodem for me =)
    It's working flawlessly, and I just wish every BBS now had Kermit.

    Same here; I believe this has to do with current hardware, OS and softwares that we all run - neat that protocols perform differently 30 years later, but kermit flies for me over telnet/ssh in terminal.



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  • From paulie420@VERT/BEERS20 to Ryan Fantus on Thu Aug 17 20:41:00 2023
    That's about the nuts and bolts of it.

    Thanks for the writeup!

    I followed the other Mystic setup, with a bash script - it w0rks perfectly... but I assume mL figured a quicker way to implement here. :P

    THANKS to mL --> 2oFB users can speed their terminal DLs up, t00!



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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to paulie420 on Fri Aug 18 10:24:40 2023
    Re: Re: kermit protocol in sy
    By: paulie420 to Christian Sacks on Thu Aug 17 2023 08:09 pm

    Kermit is about 6 times faster than Zmodem for me =)
    It's working flawlessly, and I just wish every BBS now had Kermit.

    Same here; I believe this has to do with current hardware, OS and softwares that we all run - neat that protocols perform differently 30 years later, but kermit flies for me over telnet/ssh in terminal.

    I think they're performing differently because we're using them on an internet connection rather than a serial/modem connection. File transfer protcools such as Kermit, X/Y/Zmodem etc. were designed for serial connections (with considerations for dialup modems) and as such, they were designed for raw data connections. But all the software that works with an internet connection uses network protocols such as TCP/IP & such, which already have software mechanisms for transferring data back & forth. As such, adding another file transfer protocol such as Zmodem or Kermit onto that is redundant. A file transfer protocol that has minimal overhead (which I think is true for Kermit) probably is faster over the internet than something like Zmodem.

    Nightfox

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From paulie420@VERT/BEERS20 to Nightfox on Fri Aug 18 20:59:00 2023
    Same here; I believe this has to do with current hardware, OS and softwares that we all run - neat that protocols perform differently 3 years later, but kermit flies for me over telnet/ssh in terminal.

    I think they're performing differently because we're using them on an internet connection rather than a serial/modem connection. File transfer protcools such as Kermit, X/Y/Zmodem etc. were designed for serial connections (with considerations for dialup modems) and as such, they
    were designed for raw data connections. But all the software that works with an internet connection uses network protocols such as TCP/IP &
    such, which already have software mechanisms for transferring data back
    & forth. As such, adding another file transfer protocol such as Zmodem
    or Kermit onto that is redundant. A file transfer protocol that has minimal overhead (which I think is true for Kermit) probably is faster over the internet than something like Zmodem.

    100% - its using these tools on our new tech that causes the differences. Regardless, its way better to just use www download links; but since people like using the terminal when bbsing, it is worthwhile that mL helps us offer kermit... mystic is a different beast. :P



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  • From Phigan@VERT/TACOPRON to paulie420 on Sat Aug 19 05:57:29 2023
    Re: Re: kermit protocol in sy
    By: paulie420 to Nightfox on Fri Aug 18 2023 08:59 pm

    Regardless, its way better to just use www download links; but since people like using the terminal when bbsing, it is worthwhile that mL helps us offer

    I demand jmodem support, damnit!!

    *cough*

    ---
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  • From Bf2k+@VERT/TACOPRON to Phigan on Sat Aug 19 09:19:35 2023
    Re: Re: kermit protocol in sy
    By: Phigan to paulie420 on Sat Aug 19 2023 05:57 am

    Don't forget LModem...

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ TIRED of waiting 2 hours for a taco? GO TO TACOPRONTO.bbs.io
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Bf2k+ on Sat Aug 19 21:30:26 2023
    Re: Re: kermit protocol in sy
    By: Bf2k+ to Phigan on Sat Aug 19 2023 09:19 am

    Re: Re: kermit protocol in sy
    By: Phigan to paulie420 on Sat Aug 19 2023 05:57 am

    Don't forget LModem...

    whats lmodem?
    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From Bf2k+@VERT/TACOPRON to MRO on Sun Aug 20 21:08:55 2023
    Re: Re: kermit protocol in sy
    By: MRO to Bf2k+ on Sat Aug 19 2023 09:30 pm

    whats lmodem?
    In the Atari BBS world back in the 80's, Keith Ledbetter wrote BBS:Express Pro and BBS:Express ST. LModem was a protocol he designed for his BBSes.

    I was just mentioning it to Phigan as a joke...

    ---
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  • From The Lizard Master@VERT/NITEEYES to Phigan on Mon Aug 21 08:17:18 2023
    Re: Re: kermit protocol in sy
    By: Phigan to paulie420 on Sat Aug 19 2023 05:57 am

    I demand jmodem support, damnit!!

    *cough*

    I'm protesting SyncTerm and Syncronet until I see Punter starting today. Who's with me!

    ---TLM

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ Nite Eyes BBS - To make people happy about my tagline everywhere...
  • From Phigan@VERT/TACOPRON to The Lizard Master on Mon Aug 21 09:46:17 2023
    Re: Re: kermit protocol in sy
    By: The Lizard Master to Phigan on Mon Aug 21 2023 08:17 am

    I'm protesting SyncTerm and Syncronet until I see Punter starting today. Who's with me!

    Hah! They might actually take up this one :). Surprised there isn't such support already!

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ TIRED of waiting 2 hours for a taco? GO TO TACOPRONTO.bbs.io
  • From Digital Man@VERT to Phigan on Mon Aug 21 10:20:26 2023
    Re: Re: kermit protocol in sy
    By: Phigan to The Lizard Master on Mon Aug 21 2023 09:46 am

    I'm protesting SyncTerm and Syncronet until I see Punter starting today. Who's with me!

    Hah! They might actually take up this one :). Surprised there isn't such support already!

    https://gitlab.synchro.net/main/sbbs/-/issues/300
    --
    digital man (rob)

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  • From Ragnarok@VERT/DOCKSUD to The Lizard Master on Mon Aug 21 21:47:35 2023
    El 21/8/23 a las 09:17, The Lizard Master escribió:
    Re: Re: kermit protocol in sy
    By: Phigan to paulie420 on Sat Aug 19 2023 05:57 am

    > I demand jmodem support, damnit!!
    >
    > *cough*

    I'm protesting SyncTerm and Syncronet until I see Punter starting today. Who's with me!

    SBBS support for external protocols, maybe a good implementation of
    punker could be work

    syncterm have not this way.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ Dock Sud BBS TLD 24 HS - bbs.docksud.com.ar
  • From Phigan@VERT/TACOPRON to Digital Man on Mon Aug 21 19:48:55 2023
    Re: Re: kermit protocol in sy
    By: Digital Man to Phigan on Mon Aug 21 2023 10:20 am

    Hah! They might actually take up this one :). Surprised there isn't such support already!

    https://gitlab.synchro.net/main/sbbs/-/issues/300

    Ahhh, that's more like it :).

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ TIRED of waiting 2 hours for a taco? GO TO TACOPRONTO.bbs.io
  • From The Lizard Master@VERT/NITEEYES to Digital Man on Tue Aug 22 07:25:34 2023
    Re: Re: kermit protocol in sy
    By: Digital Man to Phigan on Mon Aug 21 2023 10:20 am

    I'm protesting SyncTerm and Syncronet until I see Punter starting today. Who's with me!

    Hah! They might actually take up this one :). Surprised there isn't such support already!

    https://gitlab.synchro.net/main/sbbs/-/issues/300

    Protest withdrawn.

    ---TLM

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ Nite Eyes BBS - To make people happy about my tagline everywhere...
  • From Dredster@VERT/CAVERNS to Bf2k+ on Tue Aug 22 23:43:52 2023
    Re: Re: kermit protocol in sy
    By: Bf2k+ to MRO on Sun Aug 20 2023 09:08 pm

    whats lmodem?
    In the Atari BBS world back in the 80's, Keith Ledbetter wrote BBS:Express Pro and BBS:Express ST. LModem was a protocol he designed for his BBSes.

    I was just mentioning it to Phigan as a joke...



    You forgot the old C= standard, Punter!

    Dred

    ---
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  • From Dredster@VERT/CAVERNS to The Lizard Master on Tue Aug 22 23:44:57 2023
    Re: Re: kermit protocol in sy
    By: The Lizard Master to Phigan on Mon Aug 21 2023 08:17 am

    I'm protesting SyncTerm and Syncronet until I see Punter starting today. Who's with me!

    ---TLM

    And as soon as I mention Punter, the very NEXT message mentions Punter :)

    Dred

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Caverns BBS - No matter where you go, there you are...